Sitting here we can only map such utterings to what we know or able to infer. But as our current scientific knowledge expands, we may be able to understand upanishads better and who knows they can even help us understand science better.
I see a lot of sense and values in many methods, techniques used by our ancestors, which has come out of their hard life experiences, but somewhere the baton has not been handed over properly and such knowledge has passed on to unscientific crooks, who exploit it for their selfish gains.
Again, this is my personal view. We cannot say for sure which is right or which is wrong. We need to adopt things that appear useful and move on..
"Aum" has been an enchanting word, for several centuries in the Indian sub-continent. "Aum" is pronounced more as "Om".
It has gained a religious connotation throughout these years, as a way of communicating with God. But Aum, I suspect, was designed by our rishis with a different idea.
Mandukya upanishad explains Aum in its entirety. People think Aum is made of three sounds. But it is made of four quarters. Three sounds followed by a Silence.
Aum needs to be followed by a silence always. Without the silence, Aum is not complete. Including the silence, Aum is made of four quarters, as Mandukya Upanishad calls it.
When we say 'A', (the start of O)our lips part and the sound is produced from the vocal chord, coming out, without disturbed by our lips. It is a raw sound emanating from our vocal chords. It is a gross sound.
When we say 'U', (the end of O, just before we start 'M') our lips come closer and the sound produced from the vocal chord is modulated by our lips. It is a subtle sound.
When we say 'M', our lips close and the sound is a reverberation of the vocal chord only. It is a kind of sleepy sound or idle sound that can put us to sleep.
When we remain silent, our lips, tongue, vocal chord and such organs stop functioning. Our brain gets activated. It has to perceive the silence. Hearing silence may be a function of ears. But perceiving silence is a function of our brain. Hence at the end of Aum, brain should get activated to perceive the silence.
According to Mandukya Upanishad, AUM is imperishable. Imperishable as we see in this world are time, space and matter/energy.
For the subject of this discussion, I am going to map AUM to entire model of Universe, as we know today, in terms of matter and energy, which are imperishable.
My contention is that Mandukya Upanishad explains AUM as a representation or model of the Universe. How this model was perceived by the Rishis in those days is not known to me. May be they made a model based on their inner experiences or analogies. But, I find that AUM can be mapped to existing standard model of universe.
The 'A' sound is a raw or gross sound that indicates matter or mass. In most languages, 'A' or a similar sound is the starting alphabet. Mass or Matter is a gross element, visible to those who look outwardly or superficially. Mass is experienced by everyone, whose consciousness is outward.
The 'U' sound is a subtle sound, that indicates energy. Energy is a subtle element, visible to those who look for it deeply or inwardly. Energy is experienced only when we possess deep knowledge and consciousness.
The 'M' sound is a deep sleepy sound that indicates dark matter/energy.
Like the silence that exists beyond AUM, there exists the unknown beyond all these, which is not perceivable by our senses, but can be visualized by our brains.
Mandukya Upanishad says, AUM is the representation of Self, Atman or Brahman.
I say that AUM represents the standard model of universe by depicting matter, energy and dark matter/energy.
Actually Universe is what is called as Atman, Brahman or The Self.
Atman or Brahman by definition is something that is present in everything and everyone. If matter, energy and dark matter/energy make up the universe, then they make us also.
Thus AUM by indicating the very composition of this universe itself, indicates the Self, Atman or Brahman. As Carl Sagan once put it "We are part of the star dust".
Mandukya Upanishad says AUM has four quarters. As explained previously, 3 sounds and silence form the four quarters from a linguistic perspective.
The first quarter is Vaisvanara, which is a state of waking up, enjoying gross elements, where the consciousness is outward or superficial.
From a linguistic perspective, 'A' sound is gross and indicates wake up state.
From a scientific perspective, the gross element, which is perceived by our outward consciousness is the Mass or Matter. (Sthula as Mandukya upanishad puts it)
Mandukya Upanishad says AUM in Vaisvanara state has 7 limbs (saptanga).
Mass or Matter is associated with particles and forces from the viewpoint of particle physics. It is composed of 7 parts. Quarks (Protons/neutrons etc), Leptons (electrons, nuetrinos etc), weak force ( gluons), strong force (W and Z bosons), electromagnetic force (photons), a force that gives mass to other particles (Higgs boson) and gravitational force (called graviton) are the 7 basic parts of matter.
Mandukya Upanishad says AUM in Vaisvanara state (externally conscious, wake-up state) has 19 faces (ekonavimzati mukah) through which it is expressed outside.
Modern scientists define the following states of matter, which they have been able to observe in labs or hypothesize for the sake of completeness. The states of matter are Amorphous solids, Crystalline Solids, Liquids, Liquid Crystals, Gas, Supercritical Liquid, Colloid, Plasma, Electron-Degenerate Matter, Neutronium, Quantum Hall of 2 dimensional electron systems, Quantum Spin Hall state, Bose Einstein condensate, Fermionic condensate, Supersolids, Superfluids, Quark-gluon plasma, Weakly Symmetric matter and strongly Symmetric matter. These add upto 19 states in which matter can express itself or the faces of matter.
The second quarter is Taijasa, where consciousness is deep and inward. This is the state in which subtle elements are experienced.
From a linguistic perspective, 'U' sound is subtle and indicates dream state. In this state, consciousness is present, but can experience subtle elements. The subtle element, which is experienced by deeper understanding is 'Energy' from a scientific perspective.
Mandukya Upanishad says AUM in Taijasa state has 7 limbs (saptanga) and 19 faces, which is same as that of Vaisvanara state.
Energy and Mass are manifestations of the same thing in a different form. Hence the seven parts that make up the matter and the nineteen faces through which matter is expressed is also applicable for Energy as they are one and the same, but forms are different.
The quarters of Taijasa and Vaisvanara indicate energy and matter from a scientific perspective, which is consciously visible to us.
The third quarter is Prajna, which indicates deep sleep. This quarter is a bundle of undifferentiated mass filled with eternal bliss.
From a linguistic perspective, 'M' indicates a state in which is totally idle or sleepy.
From a scientific perspective, one which does not express itself, one which is not visible to our consciousness or tools is the dark matter/dark energy. It is a vital part of our model of universe, but one which cannot be detected. Hence it is called 'dark'. It plays a key role in the standard model of our universe.
From a scientific perspective, Prajna is the quarter that pertains to dark matter or dark energy.
Mandukya Upanishad says that face of this quarter is consciousness (ceto mukah). It means that in this quarter there is no parts or expressions of its own, unlike the previous two quarters. It can be felt only by the impact it makes on others. It can be felt only by consciousness.
The dark matter or dark energy does not have any parts or states. It cannot be seen or detected. It can only be experienced by the impact it makes on matter.
According to Mandukya Upanishad, the fourth quarter is soundless: unutterable, a quieting down of all relative manifestations, blissful, peaceful, non-dual.
From a linguistic perspective, it is indicated by the silence that follows the 'M'.
Mandukya Upanishad also says that "This is the Lord of All; the Omniscient; the Indwelling Controller; the Source of All. This is the beginning and end of all beings"
"It is neither inward-turned nor outward-turned consciousness, nor the two together; not an indifferentiated mass of consciousness; neither knowing, nor unknowing; invisible, ineffable, intangible, devoid of characteristics, inconceivable, indefinable, its sole essence being the consciousness of its own Self; the coming to rest of all relative existence; utterly quiet; peaceful; blissful; without a second: this is the Atman, the Self; this is to be realised"
From a scientific perspective, this is the unknown beyond all that is known to us directly or indirectly. As science progresses, human beings will evolve tools that better detect, better sense and better understand the natural processes that occur around us.
But still, like the silence beyond all sounds, there will be an unknown that will ever need to be explored, which is neither this nor that, which is indefinable.
Mandukya Upanishad says that AUM is the Brahman or Atman or The Self.
From a scientific perspective, AUM may very well indicate matter, energy, dark matter/energy and the unknown that is beyond complete with the particles and states of matter and energy.
Matter, Energy, Dark matter/energy, Particles and States of matter together make up the Universe or the Standard Model of Universe as we know it today.
We being part of the Universe are also made of the same that Universe is made of.
AUM by indicating the Universe with its components and states, depict the Atman or Brahman or the Self.
-TBT
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written by Pragnyan, 2009-07-07 08:45:03
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written by P. Desikan, 2008-09-15 13:29:07
Friends, view of the fascinating nature of the subject, the excellent effort on the part of TBT to give his interpretation of the upanishad and the interest shown by three medhavis, I decided to add one kind of help, by trying to provide a literal translation of the 12 brief mantras of the upanishad. Mandukya upanishad is brief; hence this adventure. I am not going to offer explanations, interpretations. I am also skipping the meaning of the excellent shanti mantra of the upanishad. Please wish me luck.
Khanda 1, mantra 1. This akshara aum is all this. What is meant by that statement is that aumkara is all of the past, the present and the future. If there is anything beyond these three spans of time, even that is aumkara.
Khanda 1, mantra 2. All this is brahman. This atma is brahman. This atma has four quarters.
khanda 2, mantra 1. The first quarter is Vaisvaanara, who is stationed in (who manages) the wakeful state, whose consciousness is outward oriented, who has seven limbs, who has nineteen mouths, and who enjoys gross things.
khanda 2, mantra 2. The second quarter is Taijasa, who is stationed in (who is active in) the dream state, whose consciousness is inward oriented, who has seven limbs, who has nineteen mouths and who enjoys subtle objects.
khanda 2, mantra 3. Sushupta is that state, where the jivatma, (the sleeper) does not desire any object of desire and does not see (experience) any dream. The third quarter is Praajna, stationed in sushupta, who has attained oneness, who is like a mass of consciousness (supreme awareness), who is bliss incarnate, who enjoys bliss, who faces (the jiva's) mind.
khanda 2, mantra 4. This sushupta-resident is the Lord of all, who knows everything, who stays within and controls all beings, who is the origin in whom every being is born and also gets destroyed.
khanda 2, mantra 5. They consider the fourth quarter as the Atma whom one has to know. This is not the consciousness of the inner space, not the consciousness of the outer space, not the consciousness of the inner and outer spaces, not a mass of consciousness, not consciousness, not non-consciousness. This is not visible, not accessible, not comprehensible, not inferable, not imaginable by thought, not describable, but the object of awareness of its being the one, in whom all prapancha ceases to exist, who is peaceful, auspicious, unique without a second.
khanda 3, mantra 1. This very Atma exists in the akshara, aumkara and is related to its matras. The matras are the quarters of the akshara aum. namely akara, ukara and makara.
khanda 3, mantra 2. Vaisvanara, who occupies the waking state, is akara, the first matra, both because of all-pervasiveness and of being the first.
Whoever knows this attains all that he desires and becomes the foremost.
khanda 3, mantra 3. Taijasa, who resides in the dream state, is ukara, the second matra because of excellence and similarity to Praajna. Whoever knows this will become famous as the guide to wise disciples (sons) and equal to great persons. In his lineage, no one who does not understand brahman will be born.
khanda 3, mantra 4. Praajna, who stays in deep sleep state, is makara, the third matra, both because of control and of absorbing capacity. Whoever knows this will get a measure of all this and also absorb all of it.
khanda 4, mantra 1. Atma himself, unlimited by matras,is the fourth, in whom all prapancha ceases to exist,who is auspicious and unique without a second, who is thus all of aumkara. Whoever knows this seeks and finds the Atma with Atma's help.
Warm regards. Partha
Khanda 1, mantra 1. This akshara aum is all this. What is meant by that statement is that aumkara is all of the past, the present and the future. If there is anything beyond these three spans of time, even that is aumkara.
Khanda 1, mantra 2. All this is brahman. This atma is brahman. This atma has four quarters.
khanda 2, mantra 1. The first quarter is Vaisvaanara, who is stationed in (who manages) the wakeful state, whose consciousness is outward oriented, who has seven limbs, who has nineteen mouths, and who enjoys gross things.
khanda 2, mantra 2. The second quarter is Taijasa, who is stationed in (who is active in) the dream state, whose consciousness is inward oriented, who has seven limbs, who has nineteen mouths and who enjoys subtle objects.
khanda 2, mantra 3. Sushupta is that state, where the jivatma, (the sleeper) does not desire any object of desire and does not see (experience) any dream. The third quarter is Praajna, stationed in sushupta, who has attained oneness, who is like a mass of consciousness (supreme awareness), who is bliss incarnate, who enjoys bliss, who faces (the jiva's) mind.
khanda 2, mantra 4. This sushupta-resident is the Lord of all, who knows everything, who stays within and controls all beings, who is the origin in whom every being is born and also gets destroyed.
khanda 2, mantra 5. They consider the fourth quarter as the Atma whom one has to know. This is not the consciousness of the inner space, not the consciousness of the outer space, not the consciousness of the inner and outer spaces, not a mass of consciousness, not consciousness, not non-consciousness. This is not visible, not accessible, not comprehensible, not inferable, not imaginable by thought, not describable, but the object of awareness of its being the one, in whom all prapancha ceases to exist, who is peaceful, auspicious, unique without a second.
khanda 3, mantra 1. This very Atma exists in the akshara, aumkara and is related to its matras. The matras are the quarters of the akshara aum. namely akara, ukara and makara.
khanda 3, mantra 2. Vaisvanara, who occupies the waking state, is akara, the first matra, both because of all-pervasiveness and of being the first.
Whoever knows this attains all that he desires and becomes the foremost.
khanda 3, mantra 3. Taijasa, who resides in the dream state, is ukara, the second matra because of excellence and similarity to Praajna. Whoever knows this will become famous as the guide to wise disciples (sons) and equal to great persons. In his lineage, no one who does not understand brahman will be born.
khanda 3, mantra 4. Praajna, who stays in deep sleep state, is makara, the third matra, both because of control and of absorbing capacity. Whoever knows this will get a measure of all this and also absorb all of it.
khanda 4, mantra 1. Atma himself, unlimited by matras,is the fourth, in whom all prapancha ceases to exist,who is auspicious and unique without a second, who is thus all of aumkara. Whoever knows this seeks and finds the Atma with Atma's help.
Warm regards. Partha
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written by TheBigThinkg, 2007-04-05 08:17:55
Dear Karigar,
You are right.
When I wrote praising god forms, what I meant was as part of a prayer. Ofcourse what I wrote and what I meant are highly diverging.
AUM is an embodiment of everything that is utterable, as u wrote. It has nothing to do with prayers or praise or belief or faith. (It is my view).
I often tell people that science was our *religion* in those days, when upanishads were being written. Science and Religion were same. A way of life to better our life experience. Rishis were the scientists.
But we have lost many of that and probably the scientific signifcance of AUM too, wherein it has got associated with some beliefs and faiths.
-TBT
You are right.
When I wrote praising god forms, what I meant was as part of a prayer. Ofcourse what I wrote and what I meant are highly diverging.
AUM is an embodiment of everything that is utterable, as u wrote. It has nothing to do with prayers or praise or belief or faith. (It is my view).
I often tell people that science was our *religion* in those days, when upanishads were being written. Science and Religion were same. A way of life to better our life experience. Rishis were the scientists.
But we have lost many of that and probably the scientific signifcance of AUM too, wherein it has got associated with some beliefs and faiths.
-TBT
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written by karigar, 2007-04-05 07:53:53
What I tried to write was, AUM the way it was positioned in praising god forms, could have lost the original intent and thought.
====end quote===
I'm not sure what you mean by above. Do you mean the commonly chanted phrases like "Om namah shivah", or "Om vishnave namah", etc...??
If you do, then I'd say that the use of Om here is not to "praise" any "god forms".
"Om" is recognized by the typical hindu/jain/buddhist/sikh (Indic) as having a meaning independent of any other words.
On the contrary, "Om" is used to exalt/convey the respect with which the idea of "vishnu", "shiva" etc are used in the above phrases.
For a Sikh, it would be "Ek-Y-Om-kar Sat naam..." & variations
For a Buddhist, it would be "Om name padme hum" and variations.
The meaning with which the "aum / om" is chanted remains basically the same...an attempt to unify & embody all that is utterable.
So I'm not sure what you are trying to isolate here by saying "AUM per se has nothing to do with religion or scriptures" (ref also to yr prev comment)
====end quote===
I'm not sure what you mean by above. Do you mean the commonly chanted phrases like "Om namah shivah", or "Om vishnave namah", etc...??
If you do, then I'd say that the use of Om here is not to "praise" any "god forms".
"Om" is recognized by the typical hindu/jain/buddhist/sikh (Indic) as having a meaning independent of any other words.
On the contrary, "Om" is used to exalt/convey the respect with which the idea of "vishnu", "shiva" etc are used in the above phrases.
For a Sikh, it would be "Ek-Y-Om-kar Sat naam..." & variations
For a Buddhist, it would be "Om name padme hum" and variations.
The meaning with which the "aum / om" is chanted remains basically the same...an attempt to unify & embody all that is utterable.
So I'm not sure what you are trying to isolate here by saying "AUM per se has nothing to do with religion or scriptures" (ref also to yr prev comment)
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written by TheBigThinkg, 2007-04-05 02:28:36
Dear Hatimtai,
In my view, AUM has become significant in Hindu religion the way it was used in praising the god forms.
AUM according to Mandukya Upanishad indicates Atman or Brahman. I have tried in this article to map Brahman to Universe and how explanation of AUM fits it properly.
In my view, AUM per se has nothing to do with religion or scriptures. Since Brahman is the starting and ending point, all chants to god start with AUM.
-TBT
In my view, AUM has become significant in Hindu religion the way it was used in praising the god forms.
AUM according to Mandukya Upanishad indicates Atman or Brahman. I have tried in this article to map Brahman to Universe and how explanation of AUM fits it properly.
In my view, AUM per se has nothing to do with religion or scriptures. Since Brahman is the starting and ending point, all chants to god start with AUM.
-TBT
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written by TheBigThinkg, 2007-04-05 02:23:51
Dear Karigar,
Thanx for ur comments.
I think the word AUM has nothing to do with what you call as religion or secular. Is science secular or religious..?
In those days, what we call as religion now should have been the science of living. I will write my views on it sometime.
What I tried to write was, AUM the way it was positioned in praising god forms, could have lost the original intent and thought.
Again my surmise.
-TBT
-TBT
Thanx for ur comments.
I think the word AUM has nothing to do with what you call as religion or secular. Is science secular or religious..?
In those days, what we call as religion now should have been the science of living. I will write my views on it sometime.
What I tried to write was, AUM the way it was positioned in praising god forms, could have lost the original intent and thought.
Again my surmise.
-TBT
-TBT
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written by TheBigThinkg, 2007-04-05 02:11:24
Dear Gangp,
'Senses' and "Thoughts' originate from the same place. Without senses there is no inner reflection or simply there is nothing to reflect on.
I think (I do not have a proof), there is some uniformity in basic laws of nature. It operates similarly cross multiple domains.
Hence upanishads which are a result of reflections bring out basic laws of nature, which can be mapped to many domains.
I think this what our rishis (rishi somewhere I read is a person who observes or keenly observes) would have understood.
Hence my inference that science can help understand upanishads and upanishads can help understand science.
-TBT
'Senses' and "Thoughts' originate from the same place. Without senses there is no inner reflection or simply there is nothing to reflect on.
I think (I do not have a proof), there is some uniformity in basic laws of nature. It operates similarly cross multiple domains.
Hence upanishads which are a result of reflections bring out basic laws of nature, which can be mapped to many domains.
I think this what our rishis (rishi somewhere I read is a person who observes or keenly observes) would have understood.
Hence my inference that science can help understand upanishads and upanishads can help understand science.
-TBT
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written by Sreeparna, 2007-04-04 23:37:34
TBT- You have a lot of physics described in your article. But I did not quite understand reading your article, significance of "AUM" sound. Does it have any meaning? Why is "AUM" such an important sound in Hindu religion and scriptures?
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written by karigar, 2007-04-04 19:30:24
It has gained a religious connotation throughout these years, as a way of communicating with God. But Aum, I suspect, was designed by our rishis with a different idea.
=====End Quote=====
Nice write up, with al lot of detail. You seem to have spent some effort in mapping modern scientific terminology with the Categories & ideas expressed in the Upanishads. Quite interesting.
Personally, I feel the sanskrit terminology is capable of standing up on its own terms, and may just need some good translation into English, in a way that distortions are minimized.
Regarding the quote above, I'd agree if the meanings of "God " & "religion" were today's Western expressions.
In Indic thought, it is generally immature to posit some sort of duality between "religious" & secular" etc...The search for "Satya", "Brahman", nature of the "Self", pervades all serious Indic thought, and one cannot exclude "Aum".
"Aum" could be called a means of attaining "moksha". Is the search for "moksha" a "religious" phenomenon or a "secular" one? This type of question is not relevant to Indic (hindu/buddhist/jain/sikh etc....) context.
Thanks & Regards.
=====End Quote=====
Nice write up, with al lot of detail. You seem to have spent some effort in mapping modern scientific terminology with the Categories & ideas expressed in the Upanishads. Quite interesting.
Personally, I feel the sanskrit terminology is capable of standing up on its own terms, and may just need some good translation into English, in a way that distortions are minimized.
Regarding the quote above, I'd agree if the meanings of "God " & "religion" were today's Western expressions.
In Indic thought, it is generally immature to posit some sort of duality between "religious" & secular" etc...The search for "Satya", "Brahman", nature of the "Self", pervades all serious Indic thought, and one cannot exclude "Aum".
"Aum" could be called a means of attaining "moksha". Is the search for "moksha" a "religious" phenomenon or a "secular" one? This type of question is not relevant to Indic (hindu/buddhist/jain/sikh etc....) context.
Thanks & Regards.
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to the best of my knowledge, the Vedas have not been written...since the time of Creation, the Vedic Science had been transmitted in a disciplic succession from a Realized Spiritual Master to his qualified disciple, who were ?ruti-dh?ris or, one with a photographic memory.
but as the kali-yuga advanced, the forthcoming human generation got corrupt intelligence which affected their tiny memory faculty also...foreseeing this, ?r? Ved-Vy?s j?, The Original Guru...compiled this Complete Science and 'wrote' them, that is now worded as Books of Vedas and stuff like that...
moreover, religion without science is sentimentalism and science without religion is a mental concoction/dry intellectual analysis.
a correction to that effect is humbly sought...