And tell me what do you see?
He demanded of the prince
My liege I see you...
And?
I see the sky, the trees,
My brothers, my friends...
The guru contemplated silently
And shaking his head, said
My son you are not yet ready for the test
And so he called them all,
All the princes in his tutelage
yet none did he allow to stand trial,
By their power of observation
Stood summarily unimpressed
The wooden bird which was set
As target to the test,
Remained at rest
The arrow set in their bow
Did they see too little or much too more?
Finally he called upon Arjun
And went through the same motion
Set your arrow, to the bow
And tell me what you see?
My liege I see a bird!
If you see the bird,
then describe it to me
My lord, but for the eye
I see not the bird!
Tell me then, about the eye
My lord in the eye I see me
And now the guru knew
That the archer was prepared
For the bow and arrow were mere tools
And archery a mere path
to something deeper
For the Archer was now rid
Of his greatest adversaries three
His distractions, his preoccupations
and the notion me
in pure consciousness, he was one
in-being, and with all that be
All pervading in awareness
Yet within a point concentrated
In the objective, the I in the eye
Nodding his assent
Shoot my prince, he said
Though in my eye
Youve already passed the test
- Abhi
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written by Avi Das, 2008-06-03 21:42:49
The Archer's Tale III has been suitably changed, edited and dedicated. Am not sure I got the Meenakshi reference. Unless it has to dow with one portion of Draupadi being Shiva's wife? Or is this some other mythological reference I'm missing out on?
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written by P. Desikan, 2008-06-03 10:32:57
Dear Avi,
In retrospect, I have no regrets about the 'errors'.
They happened and we now have another lovely extension to the Meenakshi poem. With a dedication as bonus!
I shall prize this. The first time a poem has been dedicated to me!
Regards. Partha.
In retrospect, I have no regrets about the 'errors'.
They happened and we now have another lovely extension to the Meenakshi poem. With a dedication as bonus!
I shall prize this. The first time a poem has been dedicated to me!
Regards. Partha.
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written by Avi Das, 2008-06-02 20:31:07
...The construct of the task
Was the work of Vishwakarma
Based on the workings of the world
The stratagem of Maya
To see the reflection in alignment
As one would verily lean
The reflection of the archer
Would render the target unseen
Were one to withdraw the eye sight
One would have to counter
Not just the wind, however slight
But the tricks of reflection, refraction and light
If one concentrated on the fish’s eye
The flicker of wheel would
Make the fish wave and shimmer
With a near impassable disc in between
The bowl of oil set, to the mesmerize
One and nearly all, aligned to the archer’s mind
Would on minds’ agitation tremble and shimmer
Offering no tratak to find therein
Were one to seek a moment’s opportunity, concentrate
in catching a gap betwixt the spoke of wheels
would forever be drawn to the revolutions
and in motion’s entice lose sight of the fish within
How was one to achieve target
without concentration, visualization nor aim
or considerations of the objective’s milieu
And find that ephemeral now, to shoot the arrow?
The task set to find Drona’s challenger
Would call for test of skills
beyond the master’s teachings
Beyond senses and mind prowess known hitherto herein
Set to task the warrior remembered
In between all extremity, there was to be found
divinity and in his mind, the Parth
invoked Narsimha, the god of creativity, summarily...
Dedicated to Partha
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written by Avi Das, 2008-06-02 20:27:32
Dear Partha,
Let me assure you that I definitely don’t look at your observations as means of finding fault. Indeed in the minuteness of your perusal I find consummate appreciation. Indeed it’s a fodder to my own inspiration. I personally believe all concepts must be attacked. The ‘truth’, in case there is any, will withstand. What is not truth will wither, so I do invite scrutiny. It helps one seek inspiration better.
Wrt Error 1.
I do think this error is the most poetic of all. I wonder if leads any credence to my contention that the moment is also an author along with the author?
Wrt Error 2.
Yes I had wanted to portray that Arjun would use ‘visualization’ as a technique to hit his target, but even here he failed
Error 3.
Is not an error at all.
In fact it was your query as to how one who had seen the ‘I’ in the ‘eye’ need to surrender his skills at this moment? This lead to some further fleshing out of the Swayamvar poem. Hat I post here as also dedicate to you, as it was your probe or ‘deemed’ probe which motivated me to probe further. Hope you accept co-authorship in this.
Let me assure you that I definitely don’t look at your observations as means of finding fault. Indeed in the minuteness of your perusal I find consummate appreciation. Indeed it’s a fodder to my own inspiration. I personally believe all concepts must be attacked. The ‘truth’, in case there is any, will withstand. What is not truth will wither, so I do invite scrutiny. It helps one seek inspiration better.
Wrt Error 1.
I do think this error is the most poetic of all. I wonder if leads any credence to my contention that the moment is also an author along with the author?
Wrt Error 2.
Yes I had wanted to portray that Arjun would use ‘visualization’ as a technique to hit his target, but even here he failed
Error 3.
Is not an error at all.
In fact it was your query as to how one who had seen the ‘I’ in the ‘eye’ need to surrender his skills at this moment? This lead to some further fleshing out of the Swayamvar poem. Hat I post here as also dedicate to you, as it was your probe or ‘deemed’ probe which motivated me to probe further. Hope you accept co-authorship in this.
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written by P. Desikan, 2008-06-02 20:16:04
Dear Avi,
I must go through admission of errors, first to avoid taking credit that is not my due and next to let you know how I read your fish-eye poem.
Error 1.
The line
and knew how to get the fish in the eye,
which is occurring in my comment after my signature was not put there by me at all. It has to follow the 5th line, namely
at the reflection that was not there
and end up next to it with a full stop it left behind. Something seems to have happened when I pressed the Add Comment button, which I cannot explain.
Error 2.
In the poem on the fish-eye,
Arjuna closes his eye in the first line of the 10th stanza,and I am giving your stanza here
To visualize he shut his eye, as he always did
To see his target met, in consciousness perceive
Yet this time all he perceived
Was the whirl of the wheel
The shimmer on the oil’s surface
In the third line you do write, this time all he perceived. You mean of course that after the visualization with the closed eye, he does open his eye to see the target. I must have read the lines casually and not finding an explicit reference to the reopening of the eye, decided that you let Arjuna shoot away with eyes closed. My mistake.
Error 3.
I was actually enjoying and appreciating what I considered your deliberate changes from the old story to stress your lessons on Arjuna's special archery-skills, and have managed to convey the impression of finding faults where there were none. This is the creme de la creme.
My bow is bent and my quiver is empty. As you have already found out, what is there in a name? Have I explained the mess?
Your poems continue to be inspiring, both as sheer poetry and in content.
Regards. Partha.
I must go through admission of errors, first to avoid taking credit that is not my due and next to let you know how I read your fish-eye poem.
Error 1.
The line
and knew how to get the fish in the eye,
which is occurring in my comment after my signature was not put there by me at all. It has to follow the 5th line, namely
at the reflection that was not there
and end up next to it with a full stop it left behind. Something seems to have happened when I pressed the Add Comment button, which I cannot explain.
Error 2.
In the poem on the fish-eye,
Arjuna closes his eye in the first line of the 10th stanza,and I am giving your stanza here
To visualize he shut his eye, as he always did
To see his target met, in consciousness perceive
Yet this time all he perceived
Was the whirl of the wheel
The shimmer on the oil’s surface
In the third line you do write, this time all he perceived. You mean of course that after the visualization with the closed eye, he does open his eye to see the target. I must have read the lines casually and not finding an explicit reference to the reopening of the eye, decided that you let Arjuna shoot away with eyes closed. My mistake.
Error 3.
I was actually enjoying and appreciating what I considered your deliberate changes from the old story to stress your lessons on Arjuna's special archery-skills, and have managed to convey the impression of finding faults where there were none. This is the creme de la creme.
My bow is bent and my quiver is empty. As you have already found out, what is there in a name? Have I explained the mess?
Your poems continue to be inspiring, both as sheer poetry and in content.
Regards. Partha.
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written by Avi Das, 2008-06-02 18:01:03
Dear Dwai,
No disputes about Martial arts in their practices at the highest level being spiritual. As also, as most martial arts are said to have derived from Kalaripeytu and as kalaripeytu itself supposed to have been derived from Dhanur Vidya, I can't deny their inter-link. Whether Kyodo is linked with Dhanur Vidya, I don't know (which is an admission to the limitation of my knowledge, not to be interpreted as a refutation to your claim).
Its an interesting inference you have of equating 'achieving oneness with Tao' with that of Shunyata. I guess while both have similar connotations, whether they differ in exactness, again I'm unable to tell. Cos of the little I know, Sunyata is a means of experiencing dissolution of self and pertains to the non-existence of self, while oneness with Tao pertains to be in harmony with the flow of things. Yet I guess at the highest level the experience for all would be similar.
Wrt the book, I do believe Zen in the Art of Archery by Eugen Herrigel, was the first book to be titled 'Zen in the art...'
Dear Partha,
I was sure you would live up to your name. ‘I’ will try my best to be the ‘eye’ of the fish and welcome targeting by well aimed intellectual darts.
However if I may point out, ‘I’ never mentioned that Arjun shot the arrow with his eyes closed in the swayamvar. So I guess there’s a ‘you’ involved in that authoring.
No disputes about Martial arts in their practices at the highest level being spiritual. As also, as most martial arts are said to have derived from Kalaripeytu and as kalaripeytu itself supposed to have been derived from Dhanur Vidya, I can't deny their inter-link. Whether Kyodo is linked with Dhanur Vidya, I don't know (which is an admission to the limitation of my knowledge, not to be interpreted as a refutation to your claim).
Its an interesting inference you have of equating 'achieving oneness with Tao' with that of Shunyata. I guess while both have similar connotations, whether they differ in exactness, again I'm unable to tell. Cos of the little I know, Sunyata is a means of experiencing dissolution of self and pertains to the non-existence of self, while oneness with Tao pertains to be in harmony with the flow of things. Yet I guess at the highest level the experience for all would be similar.
Wrt the book, I do believe Zen in the Art of Archery by Eugen Herrigel, was the first book to be titled 'Zen in the art...'
Dear Partha,
I was sure you would live up to your name. ‘I’ will try my best to be the ‘eye’ of the fish and welcome targeting by well aimed intellectual darts.
However if I may point out, ‘I’ never mentioned that Arjun shot the arrow with his eyes closed in the swayamvar. So I guess there’s a ‘you’ involved in that authoring.
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written by P. Desikan, 2008-06-02 16:39:52
The Mahabharata of course, Abhi.
The Archer too, of course.
He closed his eye last time,
refusing to look
at the reflection that was not there.
This time too he did something
that others do not even try.
Others who want to see their 'I's
would close their eyes; he did not.
Eyes fully open, he did not see in the bird's eye
Anything but his own 'I'.
The difference in both stories,
from the same author, of course,
of the same Archer, of course,
from Mahabharata, of course,
Is something we do not see in the Book
or in the helpful illustrations
that you have appended;
the difference is you, Abhi.
Regards. Partha.
and knew how to get the fish in the eye
The Archer too, of course.
He closed his eye last time,
refusing to look
at the reflection that was not there.
This time too he did something
that others do not even try.
Others who want to see their 'I's
would close their eyes; he did not.
Eyes fully open, he did not see in the bird's eye
Anything but his own 'I'.
The difference in both stories,
from the same author, of course,
of the same Archer, of course,
from Mahabharata, of course,
Is something we do not see in the Book
or in the helpful illustrations
that you have appended;
the difference is you, Abhi.
Regards. Partha.
and knew how to get the fish in the eye
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written by dwai, 2008-06-02 15:29:59
A book which spawned many a Zen and the art books, including Zen and the Art of Motorcycle maintenance
I don't recollect Pirsig alluding to this in his book. I will check with the MoQ discussion group and get this clarified.
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written by dwai, 2008-06-02 15:28:11
The concept of Kyudo having spiritual purpose was popularised by Zen in the Art of Archery (A book which spawned many a Zen and the art books, including Zen and the Art of Motorcycle maintenance, and a book I've long been trying to get my hands on, but haven't yet located a copy). However its also been debunked as myth in some quarters
Hi Avi,
I will check out the link you've posted in your response soon.
But to emphasize a little factoid about Martial Practices in Japan and China...
At their highest level, these practices are inherently spiritual, with the culmination being Oneness with Tao (Chinese) or achieving Shunyata. The way one approaches this is significantly different than the more "conventional" spiritual technologies, but the end result is the same.
Dhanur Veda is a lesser text in the Vedic family and it covers the nuances of Martial Arts (and Warriors were expected to be well versed in these in Ancient times).
Refer to my article on Indian Martial Arts.
Best,
Dwai
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written by Avi Das, 2008-06-02 11:59:27
Dear Dwai,
Zen is derived from Dhyan. Dhyan became Chen in China and Zen in Japan. So I guess all practices of Dhyan deals with the here and now and would be reflected in the practices of Zen. Though I must add that Zen has creatively stretched the application of dhyan in very enlightening ways.
The concept of Kyudo having spiritual purpose was popularised by Zen in the Art of Archery (A book which spawned many a Zen and the art books, including Zen and the Art of Motorcycle maintenance, and a book I've long been trying to get my hands on, but haven't yet located a copy). However its also been debunked as myth in some quarters (http://www.nanzan-u.ac.jp/SHUB...df/586.pdf). I guess you are probably referring to inferences from this book? I do hope I get to read it soon.
As most of our practices of learning is based on sadhna and in recurrent practice connecting with the flow of divine, I guess parallels can be drawn. As to whether kyodo in itself is based on Dhanur vidya I wouldn't be able to comment. Dhanu is a missile launcher, which we have interpreted to be a bow (as until the last century there was no other projectile launcher other than guns and cannons). So whether Dhanur vidya involved more esoteric and technical knowledge than merely archery or not, I wouldn't be qualified to comment.
Thanks for the appreciation.
Zen is derived from Dhyan. Dhyan became Chen in China and Zen in Japan. So I guess all practices of Dhyan deals with the here and now and would be reflected in the practices of Zen. Though I must add that Zen has creatively stretched the application of dhyan in very enlightening ways.
The concept of Kyudo having spiritual purpose was popularised by Zen in the Art of Archery (A book which spawned many a Zen and the art books, including Zen and the Art of Motorcycle maintenance, and a book I've long been trying to get my hands on, but haven't yet located a copy). However its also been debunked as myth in some quarters (http://www.nanzan-u.ac.jp/SHUB...df/586.pdf). I guess you are probably referring to inferences from this book? I do hope I get to read it soon.
As most of our practices of learning is based on sadhna and in recurrent practice connecting with the flow of divine, I guess parallels can be drawn. As to whether kyodo in itself is based on Dhanur vidya I wouldn't be able to comment. Dhanu is a missile launcher, which we have interpreted to be a bow (as until the last century there was no other projectile launcher other than guns and cannons). So whether Dhanur vidya involved more esoteric and technical knowledge than merely archery or not, I wouldn't be qualified to comment.
Thanks for the appreciation.
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written by dwai, 2008-06-02 11:28:30
Dear Avi,
Zen Martial Arts has the practice of Kyudo where similar meditative states are practiced. Perhaps that is rooted in our own Dhanur Veda?
In any case, practice of Archery can also become a meditation practice.
An excellent poem.
Dwai
Zen Martial Arts has the practice of Kyudo where similar meditative states are practiced. Perhaps that is rooted in our own Dhanur Veda?
In any case, practice of Archery can also become a meditation practice.
An excellent poem.
Dwai
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Regards. Partha.